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Poster: Iconia Date: Sep 14, 2010 3:39am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: Pro Bono Class Action

==> The problem is what exactly would our cause of action be?

Well again I'm not sure how it works n the states but if it was here then here is how it would go...

We are independent historial researchers gathering "Primary evidence" about a period in history to be used for education and preservation. If the national trust has not laid a claim to such evidence, or in this case, copies can be made, then by law you have a right to it and can even demand copies be made by RadioSpirt and supplied at cost. Endangering historical artifacts is a serious offence here in AU.

However your country may not have such laws to protect your history so here's a more universal route. Our research and documentating, even though it is non-profit, is a legal activity. If someone is directly or indirectly bocking you you ask for a court ruling to resolve the dispute. In Australia it's called asking the court for a cease and disist order to be put in place. This would make invalid any further legal action RadioSpirt may attempt on anybody with reguards to these shows or similar. This can be a 50/50 thing here and usually depends on what type of presedent the court is comfortable setting.

However if it is true that anything broadcast before the 60s that didn't have a copyright notice is public domain, then RadioSpirt would be deemed to have committed fraud and would be liable for all the time everyone has spent looking for these shows elsewhere as well as the time for IA to take them down and put them back up again plus possible criminal charges if you wanted to push it to make an example of them.

Remember, if they don't have title then they have committed a crime against not only IA, but every subscriber to IAs service. Surely these DMCA notices are monitored by a govt dept, email them as a concerned citizen and tell them about this possible act of fraud made possible by the US government and don't forget to mention you are as yet unsure of that departments criminal and civil liability over this incident.

You say it's "dirty pool" but pool is played with 2 players. I don't know what it's like in the US but in AU private individuals can't get in trouble for bringing a possibly illegal situation to the governments attention. And legal firms love to do work that could be blown up into a big deal (cause pirating is a devicive topic these days) as it raises the profile of their firm.

This is the point at which you have to ask, is you country really a free one and how much do you really care about preseving it's history for the future.

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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or StaffVideo-Cellar Date: Sep 14, 2010 5:22am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: Pro Bono Class Action

"However if it is true that anything broadcast before the 60s that didn't have a copyright notice is public domain, then RadioSpirt would be deemed to have committed fraud and would be liable for all the time everyone has spent looking for these shows elsewhere as well as the time for IA to take them down and put them back up again plus possible criminal charges if you wanted to push it to make an example of them."

Section 202 of the Australian copyright act provides specific actions and remedies against "Groundless threats of legal proceedings in relation to copyright infringement". This includes PD works and copyright works where the person or entity making the threat is not the genuine copyright holder. In US law, the copyfraud penalties are much weaker.

This post was modified by Video-Cellar on 2010-09-14 12:22:32

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Poster: Iconia Date: Sep 14, 2010 5:52am
Forum: oldtimeradio Subject: Re: Pro Bono Class Action

I did not know that, thats very interesting.

And of course anyone who purchased tape from RadioSpirt because of their actions against IA could goto the ACCC about it and maybe even ASIC as well. Yeah for big government!

Wonder what the US has in place, probably not us much as UK, AU, NZ, CA etc. Their laws seem to be based on the idea of MONEY = do what you like, NO MONEY = do what your told